Update: Patch 3.0.8 fixed Rake so that the application of the skill is now affected by Mangle. This means that it is always optimal to lead off your rotation with a Mangle, and only once the debuff is applied should you use Rake. Please disregard the rest of this article
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Rake the target for [AP / 100 + 190] bleed damage and an additional [1161 + AP * 0.18] damage over 9 sec. Awards 1 combo point.
Unfortunately, after numerous trials I am certain that (as of the current version of WoW), the initial damage from Rake is not affected by Mangle. Rake hits for nearly the same damage, varying only by two or three on each application, whether or not the enemy is affected by the Mangle debuff.
The actual Rake DoT ticks are definitely affected by Mangle - in fact Rake isn't nearly as amazing a skill if you do not maintain 100% Mangle up time.
With this in mind, I continue to recommend leading off your DPS cycle with a Rake, and following it up with a Mangle. The first tick of the bleed effect will occur almost immediately after the Mangle debuff is applied (unless you are slow), and you will achieve a slightly higher Rake up time. It's not a major boost, but every little bit counts, right?
19 comments:
i found a rake, savage roar, mangle, fb kills just about anything solo play in about 4 seconds
I enjoy the quests that say "kill x number of y creatures" just bear it up, round them up and drop em all at once. Though opening with rake...I never thought about that. I'm still stuck in the *must stealth to opener* mentality.
Not only does the rake opener not get affected by mangle, it can also crit. It appears to be totally different than the bleed.
So yeah, rake, mangle, mangle, FB is usually enough to kill anything. Stealth doesn't matter; it's just too slow.
@Fastpaws:
I'm not against bearing things up on occasion - it depends on the terrain, really, and whether or not I'm dealing with casters/archers.
@Kalon:
"Stealth doesn't matter; it's just too slow."
That's the killer for sure. I've really only used stealth as a safety feature when I AFK since Wrath.
Yeah I always open with rake. It just allows for more bleeding and the chance at a longer SR if I'm taking on several mobs at once. Also I haven't been using stealth much either I fin I can cat tank 2-3 mobs with little damage taken.
My multi-mob cat rotation is something like:
Rake, Mangle, Mangle, Rip, switch mobs, repeat.
I highly highly recommend incorporating savage roar earlier and not as a finisher.
Rake-mangle-SR and then mangle/rake depending on which is about to expire.
On higher hitpoint mobs I've been able to get two groups of combo points allowing me to TF-FB while SR is still up. I've managed to get 8k plus crits doing that.
You can also store combo points to get a 5CP SR to carry you into the next mob and keep your AP boosted.
What clued me into the rake-mangle-SR rotation was an optimal rotation recommendation in RAWR. It turned on a light-bulb in my head to treat SR as an AP boost and not a finishing move.
Willowbear
I will say kittie form has been buffed alot! Espceially with the advent of berserk and the enrgy gain on tigers fury. It is also nice to be able to burst down a player within a stunlock every 3 minutes.
The one way in which the initial Rake damage does model a bleed is that I believe it ignores armor.
I do the same in solo play: open with rake and then manglex2, FB; or if the mob has less than 3k health and I'm killing something after it I'll just SR.
Here's something that's been troubling me though: When in a multimob situation, such as an instance run where most classes can simply aoe, what is the best DPS scenario? I've been toying with skipping rake and going mangle>shred, or using rake>mangle on each mob and then simply shredding afterwards on the last mob. Is dot uptime on all mobs more efficient damage or just single targeting one mob. Love to see a post on that.
Honestly, in instance runs for AOE situations, I just go bear in kitty gear.
@ Johnmlinn In a situation like that I do a few different things.
A. Go bear and swipe away and watch my crits make rage.
B. Put up bleeds on as many targets as I can, alot of our dps is bleeds so it works out ok
C. Chain cast hurricane, go bear if you pull aggro.
Fair enough - I've gone bear to do aoe-style non-elite pulls. And I've done the hurricane thing too. But at that point I have a couple problems:
1) Why wouldn't I just put on my spell gear instances and spam hurricane, then just switch back to kitty for bosses?
2) Would you go bear and swipe spam on your typical 4-pull? Even in heroics? I realize we (probably) wouldn't pull aggro if we played it smart, but is 3-4x900dmg swipe crits worth that? I'd like to see math to back that up, because many cats can do more than that in single target dps (though I'm not one of those yet).
Cats are getting Swipe (without the insan-o Bear threat multiplier) in 3.1 supposedly.
Until then, tab-target Rake->Rip on each of the mobs in the AoE?
Thom, where did you here that. I like the idea of a cat aoe move.
Ghostcrawler announced that they were considering it last week.
Personally I see no issues with the current bear-form/swipe spam trick.... but I'm a purist. =)
Saw it here Fastpaws:
http://blue.mmo-champion.com/28/12891294995-upcoming-ae-dps-changes.html
Can't seem to make a link with <url> tags, sorry bout that.
Well Karthis you have changed the way I play my Druid yet again :P
Much faster to quest/kill without stealthing to each mob, I only stealth now when I need to reach an objective and want to get there hassle free or need to afk (munchkin aggro) for a bit. Also rake then mangle is win, the dot ticks for ~800 a pop: that adds up fast.
@Fastpaws:
Glad I could help! I used to stealth to everything and open with pounce..... but then I realized that added something like 10-15s per kill, which can really add up when you're killing dozens of mobs.
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